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Post by toley on Apr 16, 2023 8:47:02 GMT -7
Grav posted this interesting video of the Winnipeg Jets I think deserves its own thread, on how they aren't selling tickets, and are in the bottom of the league in that category. As a Canadian market, you need to be in the black or they could be on the move .... again?
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Post by Bronco73 on Apr 16, 2023 17:11:42 GMT -7
Yikes. If they move again that will be it for NHL hockey in Winnipeg, they will never get another team.
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Post by drtaf on Apr 16, 2023 18:23:12 GMT -7
Grav posted this interesting video of the Winnipeg Jets I think deserves its own thread, on how they aren't selling tickets, and are in the bottom of the league in that category. As a Canadian market, you need to be in the black or they could be on the move .... again?
It sounds like the only possible answer is a new stadium or a major reno to bring the existing one up to 18k+ capacity(no idea if thats possible)? either way, the price tag is going to be north of $500M? Presumably, the main reason its not sold out in 1st place is because "ordinary peggers" cant afford tix, and winnipeg isnt exactly Known as a "rich" city so where does this money come from?? oiler fans may not know how lucky they are that Katz squeezed Edm city just at the right time (when oil revenue was still flush). if he had waited a few more years then we'd be in same boat. it's the reason why there's been so much "hedging" on a Flames new arena and by comparison Calgary is a "rich" city compared to the Peg. I dont see winnipeg funding a new arena and it sounds a lot like the new owner is tired of losing money and doesn't want to pay out of his own pocket either? This is indeed going to be a tough scenario sooner than later. luckily the yotes fiasco overshadows all other team financial woes atm, but if the yotes get their new arena, then the jets are next up in the crosshairs IMO
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Post by toley on Apr 17, 2023 9:21:56 GMT -7
Grav posted this interesting video of the Winnipeg Jets I think deserves its own thread, on how they aren't selling tickets, and are in the bottom of the league in that category. As a Canadian market, you need to be in the black or they could be on the move .... again?
It sounds like the only possible answer is a new stadium or a major reno to bring the existing one up to 18k+ capacity(no idea if thats possible)? either way, the price tag is going to be north of $500M? Presumably, the main reason its not sold out in 1st place is because "ordinary peggers" cant afford tix, and winnipeg isnt exactly Known as a "rich" city so where does this money come from?? oiler fans may not know how lucky they are that Katz squeezed Edm city just at the right time (when oil revenue was still flush). if he had waited a few more years then we'd be in same boat. it's the reason why there's been so much "hedging" on a “disgust, dispair, emptiness and directionless” new arena and by comparison Calgary is a "rich" city compared to the Peg. I dont see winnipeg funding a new arena and it sounds a lot like the new owner is tired of losing money and doesn't want to pay out of his own pocket either? This is indeed going to be a tough scenario sooner than later. luckily the yotes fiasco overshadows all other team financial woes atm, but if the yotes get their new arena, then the jets are next up in the crosshairs IMO Like what was said in the video, the NHL can stand a couple of US franchises losing money, but if a Canadian one is, it's way bigger. Cause their income is in Canadian dollars, and they pay in USD. I'll guess this becomes something and they'll start plans to move if nothing changes. *Houston 🤔 |
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Post by fogolin2 on Apr 17, 2023 9:57:17 GMT -7
With an aging roster, and a tough destination to get players to move to, they could be in for a long dark rebuild sooner than later. That would not help the situation.
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Post by drtaf on Apr 17, 2023 23:06:55 GMT -7
With an aging roster, and a tough destination to get players to move to, they could be in for a long dark rebuild sooner than later. That would not help the situation. TBH, i was a bit surprised they made the playoffs after they started to slide? They, put together a really good roster considering they have every card stacked against them, but that roster is teaching its best before date so it will be quite impressive indeed if they can avoid the tough rebuild, but they'll have to or the team will be in big trouble!
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Post by Bronco73 on Apr 18, 2023 17:35:18 GMT -7
With Atlanta building a new NHL arena, if I'm a jets fan I'm getting very nervous about losing my team
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Post by drtaf on Apr 18, 2023 19:53:48 GMT -7
With Atlanta building a new NHL arena, if I'm a jets fan I'm getting very nervous about losing my team I read this and went WTF?? Why would they do this unless the NHL/Bettman have given them some kind of promise? Or is it a stadium built for basketball that "could" potentially do NHL as well??
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Post by Bronco73 on Apr 18, 2023 21:31:19 GMT -7
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Post by drtaf on Apr 18, 2023 23:08:12 GMT -7
this has "Coyotes" like disaster written all over it! If it ever does get built then i hope they move the coyotes to it so that we still only have 1 poverty franchise and not 2! certainly hope its not the Jets. Jets problem is infrastructure not fans. i'm pretty sure if you built a venue like this in the Peg it would sell out or damn near close. In North Atlanta?? I highly doubt it, regardless whether or not the NHL "gifts them" a ready to compete franchise!
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Post by toley on Apr 20, 2023 12:17:48 GMT -7
With Atlanta building a new NHL arena, if I'm a jets fan I'm getting very nervous about losing my team From my understanding, Atlanta is looking to make a pitch just like other rumoured city's. The Jets probably aren't moving back to Atlanta, if they do move it would probably be a different city, who knows. |
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Post by SuperDave17 on Apr 20, 2023 13:17:24 GMT -7
My sister is a pow wow dancer. She visited me several years ago for a pow wow when I still lived in the Peg, which was held in the MTS center.
A couple years later she asked me where the Jets play, under the impression that the place she was in couldn't possibly be the arena for a legit NHL franchise. It was with some shock that it sunk in, and I told her, she was already in it.
Kinda says something, doesn't it?
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Post by Bronco73 on Apr 20, 2023 14:46:54 GMT -7
With Atlanta building a new NHL arena, if I'm a jets fan I'm getting very nervous about losing my team From my understanding, Atlanta is looking to make a pitch just like other rumoured city's. The Jets probably aren't moving back to Atlanta, if they do move it would probably be a different city, who knows. ya but Seattle was just making a pitch too. The thing is, nobody is building a half a billion dollar arena without at least some sort of assurance that they will be rewarded for that investment. I think there is a lot more to this than just "it would be cool to see another NHL team here so let's build a 500 million dollar arena just in case they decide to see if we want one".
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Post by toley on Apr 20, 2023 16:30:56 GMT -7
From my understanding, Atlanta is looking to make a pitch just like other rumoured city's. The Jets probably aren't moving back to Atlanta, if they do move it would probably be a different city, who knows. ya but Seattle was just making a pitch too. The thing is, nobody is building a half a billion dollar arena without at least some sort of assurance that they will be rewarded for that investment. I think there is a lot more to this than just "it would be cool to see another NHL team here so let's build a 500 million dollar arena just in case they decide to see if we want one". Could Atlanta get another NHL franchise, sure. But it's not for relocation, it'd be for expansion. |
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Post by drtaf on Apr 20, 2023 18:59:35 GMT -7
ya but Seattle was just making a pitch too. The thing is, nobody is building a half a billion dollar arena without at least some sort of assurance that they will be rewarded for that investment. I think there is a lot more to this than just "it would be cool to see another NHL team here so let's build a 500 million dollar arena just in case they decide to see if we want one". Could Atlanta get another NHL franchise, sure. But it's not for relocation, it'd be for expansion. 32 is a very convenient number for scheduling that's why most "pro leagues" reach 32 and then stop expanding? If you go beyond, you run the very real risk of watering down your product to the point that it "aint" special anymore and people lose interest both as fans of teams who have a franchise and the casual sports observer who may drive TV revenue? I'm not saying NHL wont expand beyond 32, I'm just not so sure its a good idea when you have several franchises already not making any money or negligible profit
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Post by toley on Apr 20, 2023 20:03:36 GMT -7
Could Atlanta get another NHL franchise, sure. But it's not for relocation, it'd be for expansion. 32 is a very convenient number for scheduling that's why most "pro leagues" reach 32 and then stop expanding? If you go beyond, you run the very real risk of watering down your product to the point that it "aint" special anymore and people lose interest both as fans of teams who have a franchise and the casual sports observer who may drive TV revenue? I'm not saying NHL wont expand beyond 32, I'm just not so sure its a good idea when you have several franchises already not making any money or negligible profit MLB and NBA only have 30 teams, NFL is the only other league with 32, and they all have waaaaaaaaay bigger pools of player to choose from, so I disagree with your argument. More teams can bring in more revenue to the NHL, why wouldnt they want that? Look at what Vegas and Seattle had to pay to enter, that would only go up to for others, which going to the owners. |
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Post by drtaf on Apr 20, 2023 20:58:03 GMT -7
32 is a very convenient number for scheduling that's why most "pro leagues" reach 32 and then stop expanding? If you go beyond, you run the very real risk of watering down your product to the point that it "aint" special anymore and people lose interest both as fans of teams who have a franchise and the casual sports observer who may drive TV revenue? I'm not saying NHL wont expand beyond 32, I'm just not so sure its a good idea when you have several franchises already not making any money or negligible profit MLB and NBA only have 30 teams, NFL is the only other league with 32, and they all have waaaaaaaaay bigger pools of player to choose from, so I disagree with your argument. More teams can bring in more revenue to the NHL, why wouldnt they want that? Look at what Vegas and Seattle had to pay to enter, that would only go up to for others, which going to the owners. But doesnt this bolster my point? MLB NBA are way bigger and more popular but dont see the point of expanding even though they have considerably larger audiences and interest than the NHL? (FWIW i do think those 2 sports will eventually reach 32 but i dont expect them to go beyond). If it was just about getting expansion money the MLB NFL and NBA could go to 50 teams and I doubt if any would lose money? however, you're correct they do have much larger talent pools so their product may not get as diluted as the NHL would if it expanded, so why dont they??? Again, not saying the NHL wont go for the "quick buck", but i think part of the reason the cost of Vegas and Seattle was so high is because of the perception that they were the last "spots" available/open? Simple economic supply and demand IMO. If any of the leagues were to expand inc NHL, i think it would be in Europe because it would open up a massive new audience and TV revenue generator without negatively impacting NA franchises. the big problem of course would be logistics and travel but in reality, europe is only another ~2 hrs further away from the eastern seaboard than from west coast franchises and this could be easily overcome if they had their own "division" ie an expansion of 4 to 8 teams all at once. This is the only expansion that makes sense to me, but then again, there are an awful lot of things in this world that dont make sense to me but still happen so.... 
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Post by toley on Apr 22, 2023 6:04:52 GMT -7
MLB and NBA only have 30 teams, NFL is the only other league with 32, and they all have waaaaaaaaay bigger pools of player to choose from, so I disagree with your argument. More teams can bring in more revenue to the NHL, why wouldnt they want that? Look at what Vegas and Seattle had to pay to enter, that would only go up to for others, which going to the owners. But doesnt this bolster my point? MLB NBA are way bigger and more popular but dont see the point of expanding even though they have considerably larger audiences and interest than the NHL? (FWIW i do think those 2 sports will eventually reach 32 but i dont expect them to go beyond). If it was just about getting expansion money the MLB NFL and NBA could go to 50 teams and I doubt if any would lose money? however, you're correct they do have much larger talent pools so their product may not get as diluted as the NHL would if it expanded, so why dont they??? Again, not saying the NHL wont go for the "quick buck", but i think part of the reason the cost of Vegas and Seattle was so high is because of the perception that they were the last "spots" available/open? Simple economic supply and demand IMO. If any of the leagues were to expand inc NHL, i think it would be in Europe because it would open up a massive new audience and TV revenue generator without negatively impacting NA franchises. the big problem of course would be logistics and travel but in reality, europe is only another ~2 hrs further away from the eastern seaboard than from west coast franchises and this could be easily overcome if they had their own "division" ie an expansion of 4 to 8 teams all at once. This is the only expansion that makes sense to me, but then again, there are an awful lot of things in this world that dont make sense to me but still happen so.... If they have billionaires knocking at the door to join the league and fork over millions I totally think the league would expand, eventually. Seattle and Vegas have been very successful on and off ice. I don't believe that more team dilute the product, you can always find players and just gives those players more opportunity to be noticed, and make it Who's to know when, 3-5 year it'll be a conversation, as to which city getting the next NHL franchise? And back to topic, while the NHL has inserted themselves in the destiny of the Coyotes, the Jets are destiny is up to True North, and the Owners if they'll move and to where |
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Post by yuke on May 8, 2023 10:52:54 GMT -7
But doesnt this bolster my point? MLB NBA are way bigger and more popular but dont see the point of expanding even though they have considerably larger audiences and interest than the NHL? (FWIW i do think those 2 sports will eventually reach 32 but i dont expect them to go beyond). If it was just about getting expansion money the MLB NFL and NBA could go to 50 teams and I doubt if any would lose money? however, you're correct they do have much larger talent pools so their product may not get as diluted as the NHL would if it expanded, so why dont they??? Again, not saying the NHL wont go for the "quick buck", but i think part of the reason the cost of Vegas and Seattle was so high is because of the perception that they were the last "spots" available/open? Simple economic supply and demand IMO. If any of the leagues were to expand inc NHL, i think it would be in Europe because it would open up a massive new audience and TV revenue generator without negatively impacting NA franchises. the big problem of course would be logistics and travel but in reality, europe is only another ~2 hrs further away from the eastern seaboard than from west coast franchises and this could be easily overcome if they had their own "division" ie an expansion of 4 to 8 teams all at once. This is the only expansion that makes sense to me, but then again, there are an awful lot of things in this world that dont make sense to me but still happen so.... If they have billionaires knocking at the door to join the league and fork over millions I totally think the league would expand, eventually. Seattle and Vegas have been very successful on and off ice. I don't believe that more team dilute the product, you can always find players and just gives those players more opportunity to be noticed, and make it Who's to know when, 3-5 year it'll be a conversation, as to which city getting the next NHL franchise? And back to topic, while the NHL has inserted themselves in the destiny of the Coyotes, the Jets are destiny is up to True North, and the Owners if they'll move and to where You never know how successful a team is until they hit the skids. |
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