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Post by mrtea on Aug 11, 2021 8:46:32 GMT -7
Yes he has speed, I've seen him play in Chicago. He played pretty well. His defense is where he is lacking. A mid first round pick, do or die for him and his NHL career. He has the tools but lack some smarts. Sounds a little like Pulj Thanks for the info BH. For that price, if we get any games out of him, he’ll be a steal and every so often a late bloomer plying his trade in Europe comes back and really thrives back in the nhl so I’m thinking this is a good roll of the dice by kh, basically playing with house money to see if he can land a 3-4th liner. He’ll/We’ll soon find out in training camp I was just reading a bit about him and I'm liking this signing the more I read. Apparently he has very good speed (which was already mentioned) and has a good history with Tippet. He feels his time in Europe helped him improve his game because he was given more responsibility and ice time. He came back to North America to try and get back into the NHL and bumped into Tippet, you know the rest.
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Post by igibb on Aug 11, 2021 9:05:03 GMT -7
Krueger had most of the “young guns” playing well albeit with little D responsibility. Whether that “kid glove” treatment ruined them is debatable as I kinda side with Fog here. If a kid is given the opportunity to make millions and become an nhl star and he can’t be bothered or is unwilling to be coached to play a certain way, there’s not much sympathy to be had. After all FOA’s usually get several chances and Yak had his share but he failed with several teams and structures, not just oilers Yeah maybe I am giving him too much benefit of doubt and saying 6 teams in 6 years... his game did not change at all in those years and may have actually been worse by the end. I suppose having 6 teams try to help you out and with zero accomplishments in any aspect it probably is the Player. Unfortunate to say the least as many younger players would have wished for the same opportunities given to Yak. Effort seems to be the key to an NHL career more so then just skill. I am not a Brian Burke fan at all but when he says that Yakapov was the worst draft interview he has ever had and that Yakapov was "defiant and obnoxious" I think that gives a pretty good indication of who is most at fault for his "success" in the NHL. A young kid trying to impress potential employers who could pay him millions of dollars acting like that before he is even drafted says a lot about his character.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2021 23:48:22 GMT -7
Yeah maybe I am giving him too much benefit of doubt and saying 6 teams in 6 years... his game did not change at all in those years and may have actually been worse by the end. I suppose having 6 teams try to help you out and with zero accomplishments in any aspect it probably is the Player. Unfortunate to say the least as many younger players would have wished for the same opportunities given to Yak. Effort seems to be the key to an NHL career more so then just skill. I am not a Brian Burke fan at all but when he says that Yakapov was the worst draft interview he has ever had and that Yakapov was "defiant and obnoxious" I think that gives a pretty good indication of who is most at fault for his "success" in the NHL. A young kid trying to impress potential employers who could pay him millions of dollars acting like that before he is even drafted says a lot about his character. I like Burke but these comments came after Yakupov was on a downward spiral. If Burke would have said this right after the draft I would have respected that opinion more. where are they now?
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Post by fogolin2 on Aug 12, 2021 7:12:29 GMT -7
I am not a Brian Burke fan at all but when he says that Yakapov was the worst draft interview he has ever had and that Yakapov was "defiant and obnoxious" I think that gives a pretty good indication of who is most at fault for his "success" in the NHL. A young kid trying to impress potential employers who could pay him millions of dollars acting like that before he is even drafted says a lot about his character. I like Burke but these comments came after Yakupov was on a downward spiral. If Burke would have said this right after the draft I would have respected that opinion more. where are they now? I just watched that Burke bit on Youtube. Very interesting stuff about draft interviews. And, he says there were 2 'worst interviews' but he only mentioned Nail because the other guy is still playing....so, that explains why he didn't say anything until Yak was out of the league, and increases my respect for Burke. An active or ex GM sewering another team's player because he didn't draft that player, would be extremely poor style.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2021 1:41:19 GMT -7
I like Burke but these comments came after Yakupov was on a downward spiral. If Burke would have said this right after the draft I would have respected that opinion more. where are they now? I just watched that Burke bit on Youtube. Very interesting stuff about draft interviews. And, he says there were 2 'worst interviews' but he only mentioned Nail because the other guy is still playing....so, that explains why he didn't say anything until Yak was out of the league, and increases my respect for Burke. An active or ex GM sewering another team's player because he didn't draft that player, would be extremely poor style. I think often Burke's ego gets in the way. He likes to command the room he is in and wants everyone to think he is the authority.
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Post by fogolin2 on Aug 13, 2021 12:01:38 GMT -7
I just watched that Burke bit on Youtube. Very interesting stuff about draft interviews. And, he says there were 2 'worst interviews' but he only mentioned Nail because the other guy is still playing....so, that explains why he didn't say anything until Yak was out of the league, and increases my respect for Burke. An active or ex GM sewering another team's player because he didn't draft that player, would be extremely poor style. I think often Burke's ego gets in the way. He likes to command the room he is in and wants everyone to think he is the authority. Well, at the time, he is a manager conducting a job interview. Authority. And now, what motive does he have to exaggerate the tale? He specifically said he'd had an equally bad one, but didn't throw the guy under the bus. Seems legit to me.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 13, 2021 17:52:59 GMT -7
I think often Burke's ego gets in the way. He likes to command the room he is in and wants everyone to think he is the authority. Well, at the time, he is a manager conducting a job interview. Authority. And now, what motive does he have to exaggerate the tale? He specifically said he'd had an equally bad one, but didn't throw the guy under the bus. Seems legit to me. Burke's explanation was Yak asked why they were interviewing him as he did not think he would fall that far... to me it would seem it went south after that From Burke and his scout. I'm sure it happened but I would not put a lot into it 8 years after the fact. many players have had terrible interviews and went on to fine careers and some like Yak did not.
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south
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Post by south on Aug 14, 2021 8:05:20 GMT -7
Nail's ego, belief he was a generational superstar, and immaturity were his own worst enemy.I don't believe the Oilers ruined Yak by poor coaching or mishandled his development.He demanded an NHL roster spot prior to the draft and stated he would return home rather than sign with any team who thought differently. Remember, there were individuals with the Oilers who weren't sold on Yak and wanted a Dman. Nail didn't have a two way game nor believe team system play was relevant as it deterred his offensive creativity and personal production. He placed himself above the team success.Yes,there have been other young players that had similar attitudes that went on to long NHL careers,but most of them matured and evolved their attitudes. Nail never did.
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Post by mrtea on Aug 14, 2021 8:24:27 GMT -7
Nail's ego, belief he was a generational superstar, and immaturity were his own worst enemy.I don't believe the Oilers ruined Yak by poor coaching or mishandled his development.He demanded an NHL roster spot prior to the draft and stated he would return home rather than sign with any team who thought differently. Remember, there were individuals with the Oilers who weren't sold on Yak and wanted a Dman. Nail didn't have a two way game nor believe team system play was relevant as it deterred his offensive creativity and personal production. He placed himself above the team success.Yes,there have been other young players that had similar attitudes that went on to long NHL careers,but most of them matured and evolved their attitudes. Nail never did. What hurt Yak was that he was one dimensional and didn't take well to coaching. I remember hearing that Katz's son was the one pushing to draft Nail and the more I hear, it sounds like what most likely happened. Hard to say no to the owner.
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south
Bakersfield Roster
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Post by south on Aug 14, 2021 8:34:08 GMT -7
Nail's ego, belief he was a generational superstar, and immaturity were his own worst enemy.I don't believe the Oilers ruined Yak by poor coaching or mishandled his development.He demanded an NHL roster spot prior to the draft and stated he would return home rather than sign with any team who thought differently. Remember, there were individuals with the Oilers who weren't sold on Yak and wanted a Dman. Nail didn't have a two way game nor believe team system play was relevant as it deterred his offensive creativity and personal production. He placed himself above the team success.Yes,there have been other young players that had similar attitudes that went on to long NHL careers,but most of them matured and evolved their attitudes. Nail never did. What hurt Yak was that he was one dimensional and didn't take well to coaching. I remember hearing that Katz's son was the one pushing to draft Nail and the more I hear, it sounds like what most likely happened. Hard to say no to the owner. That's as plausible an explanation as any. 20/20 hindsight says that would have been a great year for the Oilers to trade down in the draft and let someone else deal with Yak and his attitude, but as you said "Hard to say no to the owner."
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Post by drtaf on Aug 14, 2021 10:24:13 GMT -7
I heard the push for Nail was from ownership as well and if you look at that draft, no one stood out and the D-guy touted to be better was Ryan Murray who has had a somewhat mediocre career. Also, he would never have survived the fiasco that was the oilers then because before a puck was dropped he got injured and missed his entire 1st season and at the time, the oilers were already a laughing stock of injuries so the guy would have been crucified. This was definitely the year to trade FOA away but the whole concept of tanking for FOA is seriously flawed since the teams GM that has FOA is almost forced to take the top ranked player or risk career suicide, yet as we’ve seen countless times the best player or best fit player is usually had a few places lower like Drai, Nurse and in the case of Nuge, we’d have been better off with landeskog but hindsight is 50-50and it’s likely we wouldn’t have McD if our management group then was smarter
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south
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Post by south on Aug 14, 2021 10:47:46 GMT -7
I heard the push for Nail was from ownership as well and if you look at that draft, no one stood out and the D-guy touted to be better was Ryan Murray who has had a somewhat mediocre career. Also, he would never have survived the fiasco that was the oilers then because before a puck was dropped he got injured and missed his entire 1st season and at the time, the oilers were already a laughing stock of injuries so the guy would have been crucified. This was definitely the year to trade FOA away but the whole concept of tanking for FOA is seriously flawed since the teams GM that has FOA is almost forced to take the top ranked player or risk career suicide, yet as we’ve seen countless times the best player or best fit player is usually had a few places lower like Drai, Nurse and in the case of Nuge, we’d have been better off with landeskog but hindsight is 50-50and it’s likely we wouldn’t have McD if our management group then was smarter Agreed taking the concensus Central Scouting #1 is the safe career choice, but it didn't help the GM's future in this case. The 2012 draft turned out some not bad middle round picks that year, but the very top of the draft,not so much. Hell,Wilson went to Washington @ #16 and the Oilers now have both Koekoek and Ceci from the middle round that year. If they could have traded down and got a veteran roster guy to settle down our young guys at the time plus additional picks in the package, the Oilers would have looked like geniuses now. lol
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Post by blackhawk216 on Aug 14, 2021 17:09:15 GMT -7
I heard the push for Nail was from ownership as well and if you look at that draft, no one stood out and the D-guy touted to be better was Ryan Murray who has had a somewhat mediocre career. Also, he would never have survived the fiasco that was the oilers then because before a puck was dropped he got injured and missed his entire 1st season and at the time, the oilers were already a laughing stock of injuries so the guy would have been crucified. This was definitely the year to trade FOA away but the whole concept of tanking for FOA is seriously flawed since the teams GM that has FOA is almost forced to take the top ranked player or risk career suicide, yet as we’ve seen countless times the best player or best fit player is usually had a few places lower like Drai, Nurse and in the case of Nuge, we’d have been better off with landeskog but hindsight is 50-50and it’s likely we wouldn’t have McD if our management group then was smarter "better off with Landeskog". I think that is debatable. RNH .728 pts per game, plays important role on PP and PK and can play in more than one position on top, second or third line. Landeskog .745 pts per game, I assume a big PP player for Colorado, don't know if he kills pens also, not sure how versatile he is. Hardly anything in it really to speak of, and not really to say the Oilers would have been better off with Landeskog. Or am I missing something?
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Post by windsoroiler on Aug 14, 2021 17:31:32 GMT -7
I thought this thread was about Perlini
I hope he is a Kahun on steroids type of signing. He's done it before in terms of scoring, a bit better defense hopefully some maturity like we have seen with Pulj.
If things work out we have his RFA rights to keep him here. If things go south he can be buried.
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Post by Marshall Bruce Mathers III on Aug 14, 2021 22:13:54 GMT -7
I heard the push for Nail was from ownership as well and if you look at that draft, no one stood out and the D-guy touted to be better was Ryan Murray who has had a somewhat mediocre career. Also, he would never have survived the fiasco that was the oilers then because before a puck was dropped he got injured and missed his entire 1st season and at the time, the oilers were already a laughing stock of injuries so the guy would have been crucified. This was definitely the year to trade FOA away but the whole concept of tanking for FOA is seriously flawed since the teams GM that has FOA is almost forced to take the top ranked player or risk career suicide, yet as we’ve seen countless times the best player or best fit player is usually had a few places lower like Drai, Nurse and in the case of Nuge, we’d have been better off with landeskog but hindsight is 50-50and it’s likely we wouldn’t have McD if our management group then was smarter "better off with Landeskog". I think that is debatable. RNH .728 pts per game, plays important role on PP and PK and can play in more than one position on top, second or third line. Landeskog .745 pts per game, I assume a big PP player for Colorado, don't know if he kills pens also, not sure how versatile he is. Hardly anything in it really to speak of, and not really to say the Oilers would have been better off with Landeskog. Or am I missing something? He doesn't play much PK but he's far more physical than Nuge, and although not a centre he was 56.6% on the dot last season over 509 faceoffs. Nuge took 106 faceoffs last season and was 45.6%. So, replace Nuge's PK with all around physical play and bump up his faceoffs 11 percent, and you get Landeskog. Sent from my SM-G998W using Tapatalk
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Post by drtaf on Aug 15, 2021 9:26:25 GMT -7
"better off with Landeskog". I think that is debatable. RNH .728 pts per game, plays important role on PP and PK and can play in more than one position on top, second or third line. Landeskog .745 pts per game, I assume a big PP player for Colorado, don't know if he kills pens also, not sure how versatile he is. Hardly anything in it really to speak of, and not really to say the Oilers would have been better off with Landeskog. Or am I missing something? He doesn't play much PK but he's far more physical than Nuge, and although not a centre he was 56.6% on the dot last season over 509 faceoffs. Nuge took 106 faceoffs last season and was 45.6%. So, replace Nuge's PK with all around physical play and bump up his faceoffs 11 percent, and you get Landeskog. Sent from my SM-G998W using Tapatalk My comment was a little subjective to be sure but eyeball analysis says Landry is the more valuable player. He’s been their captain almost since he was drafted, is far more physical and puts up the same pets playing all positions as well. Don’t get me wrong, I actually really like Nuge and the balance may shift in the latter half of their careers since both just signed 8yr extensions, Nigel for just over $5M and Landy for $7M so now nudge may well become the better bang for the buck but previously, Landry was making less than Nuge and IMO was the much better value for what he brought to his team be what Nuge brought to the oilers. Whenever a debate like this comes up I ask myself what would the NHL GMs (and no I don’t know for sure what they’d do) but again IMO, most would have picked Landry over Nuge on the previous contracts, now, I think it would be a lot closer and maybe even a little Nudge towards Nuge😉
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Post by drtaf on Aug 15, 2021 9:29:22 GMT -7
Kuzmenko I really have to start reading my posts before hitting send, this autocorrect Kuzmenkos up everything and I should switch it off but I have “fat thumbs” so that Kuzmenkos up the typing also. Apologies but I hope you can understand what I wrote.
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Post by blackhawk216 on Aug 15, 2021 12:15:27 GMT -7
Flames suck I really have to start reading my posts before hitting send, this autocorrect Flames sucks up everything and I should switch it off but I have “fat thumbs” so that Flames sucks up the typing also. Apologies but I hope you can understand what I wrote. All understood......all opinions welcome.......but like I say, the point under discussion is debatable. Lets also take into account that if we were now having to pay Landeskog roughly 2m more than we pay RNH, that would be a further issue for Ken Holland. We would be paying Connor, Leon, Darnell and Landeskog over 37m per year. So something else would have to give.
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Post by drtaf on Aug 15, 2021 14:17:24 GMT -7
Flames suck I really have to start reading my posts before hitting send, this autocorrect Flames sucks up everything and I should switch it off but I have “fat thumbs” so that Flames sucks up the typing also. Apologies but I hope you can understand what I wrote. All understood......all opinions welcome.......but like I say, the point under discussion is debatable. Lets also take into account that if we were now having to pay Landeskog roughly 2m more than we pay RNH, that would be a further issue for Ken Holland. We would be paying Connor, Leon, Darnell and Landeskog over 37m per year. So something else would have to give. Completely agree, that’s why I said that it may be a different story now that Nuge is making $2M less per year. but my initial comment was about when they were drafted and the subsequent years, I feel Landeskog was the better player and the better “deal. We will have to wait and see what the next 8yrs bring, but I wouldn’t bet against Nuge coming out on top, but we will just have to wait and see, an awful lot of things can happen in the next 8yrs 🤷♂️
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Post by fogolin2 on Aug 15, 2021 20:01:09 GMT -7
What hurt Yak was that he was one dimensional and didn't take well to coaching. I remember hearing that Katz's son was the one pushing to draft Nail and the more I hear, it sounds like what most likely happened. Hard to say no to the owner. That's as plausible an explanation as any. 20/20 hindsight says that would have been a great year for the Oilers to trade down in the draft and let someone else deal with Yak and his attitude, but as you said "Hard to say no to the owner." I wanted to trade down and take Trouba. I think he went 8th or 9th.
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