|
Post by Bronco73 on Mar 24, 2021 22:10:45 GMT -7
|
|
|
Post by AlwaysOil on Mar 24, 2021 22:26:26 GMT -7
I watched some of thee Sabres game...good lord....the only guy of that team that interests me is Reinhart. What a train wreck. What about Nuge if he doesn't have a deal? If you can only keep one at $6mil, do you keep Nuge or Barrie? Forgot about Nuge, you could have a handshake deal with him too without needing to protect him. If I'm correct... For me it depends on term. Look at Russell he took quite the pay cut to get locked in for next year. He's in his early thirties. I see Turris and Nuge as very similar players to tell you the truth. And he's only 31. If I recall Barrie had an off year but he lead all the leafs D in scoring. Ahead of Reilly who is a heck of a D. Still very productive for an off year. He had more money to play elsewhere but chose Edmonton. At least that's what we all heard. I like Debrusk, I like Reinhart. The other problem is it will take 3 weeks to get these players. So whatever asset you give up you are without both assets for 3 weeks. Very hard to trade with a US team for this reason I forget about Nuge, too. I am a fan. Tippet said in one of his recent videos about 4 of the leaders. Think it was Connor, Drai, Nuge, and Larsson. For me this is a no trade group. I believe we took a step back when we let Hendricks go. Good leaders can will a mediocre group to greatness. Poor leaders... not pointing to any teams south of us but...
|
|
|
Post by fogolin2 on Mar 24, 2021 22:29:26 GMT -7
I watched some of thee Sabres game...good lord....the only guy of that team that interests me is Reinhart. What a train wreck. What about Nuge if he doesn't have a deal? If you can only keep one at $6mil, do you keep Nuge or Barrie? Forgot about Nuge, you could have a handshake deal with him too without needing to protect him. If I'm correct... For me it depends on term. Look at Russell he took quite the pay cut to get locked in for next year. He's in his early thirties. I see Turris and Nuge as very similar players to tell you the truth. And he's only 31. If I recall Barrie had an off year but he lead all the leafs D in scoring. Ahead of Reilly who is a heck of a D. Still very productive for an off year. He had more money to play elsewhere but chose Edmonton. At least that's what we all heard. I like Debrusk, I like Reinhart. The other problem is it will take 3 weeks to get these players. So whatever asset you give up you are without both assets for 3 weeks. Very hard to trade with a US team for this reason Good point about the quarantine delay. Another consideration. Barrie did outscore Reilly, but he was about 20 points short of his previous years. And, in Leafland that gets you run out of town!! It will be very interesting with the handshakes and the wink-winks and the nudge-nudges up to the expansion draft. I am SO curious about what is happening with the Nuge negotiation. I thought that one would be pretty straightforward, but it seems anything but that so far.
|
|
|
Post by fogolin2 on Mar 24, 2021 22:43:47 GMT -7
That's good info, but the best thing there is "The Frozen Flannels" !!
|
|
|
Post by neufab94 on Mar 24, 2021 22:46:23 GMT -7
I kind of like the trade rules because any trade means that a commitment was made worthy of the bullshit quarantine rules! Kuzmenko you covid, I am done with you.
I am looking for a buddy who has covid so I can bring him a beer and hang out for at least an hour.
|
|
|
Post by AlwaysOil on Mar 24, 2021 22:55:17 GMT -7
I dunno who we have to protect and who is exempt. For example Lag depending on how many games he plays will determine if we would have to protect him or not. Will we have handshake deals in place to sign Larsson and or Barrie after the draft? Say we get a top 6 forward like debrusk he would need to be protected or you would be getting a rental only. Watch Stall play tonight and I'm not sure that's a good move either. Hall either I watched some of thee Sabres game...good lord....the only guy of that team that interests me is Reinhart. What a train wreck. What about Nuge if he doesn't have a deal? If you can only keep one at $6mil, do you keep Nuge or Barrie? Depends on who is available to backfill at a similar level. I’m not really good at saying so and so is available and could fill that role. So my question is who do you backfill if one of them walks? Nurse is looking pretty good this year. Could Klef coming back mean losing Barrie is not as big a deal? Internally, I don’t think we have a replacement for Nuge. At 6 mil, who is it? Not just points and being the Swiss Army knife, but the leadership? Right now the answer is Nuge, even though I really want both.
|
|
|
Post by drtaf on Mar 25, 2021 8:56:51 GMT -7
It will depend on what either player wants (salary-wise) going forward. They're both UFA's, Nuge I think has more of a will/commitment to stay with the only team he's known, but Barrie probably couldn't dream of a better scenario than the one that's unfolded for him this season and maybe he will want to keep the good vibe going? Both may well be able to get more on the open market than here, so it will depend on who wants to be an oiler the most? I hope they both take team friendly contracts but wont blame them if they don't and we could end up with neither? If they both go, they will leave 2 huge holes to fill, the oilers long-term future is definitely in KH's hands this season and next.
|
|
|
Post by windsoroiler on Mar 25, 2021 8:59:29 GMT -7
Forgot about Nuge, you could have a handshake deal with him too without needing to protect him. If I'm correct... For me it depends on term. Look at Russell he took quite the pay cut to get locked in for next year. He's in his early thirties. I see Turris and Nuge as very similar players to tell you the truth. And he's only 31. If I recall Barrie had an off year but he lead all the leafs D in scoring. Ahead of Reilly who is a heck of a D. Still very productive for an off year. He had more money to play elsewhere but chose Edmonton. At least that's what we all heard. I like Debrusk, I like Reinhart. The other problem is it will take 3 weeks to get these players. So whatever asset you give up you are without both assets for 3 weeks. Very hard to trade with a US team for this reason Good point about the quarantine delay. Another consideration. Barrie did outscore Reilly, but he was about 20 points short of his previous years. And, in Leafland that gets you run out of town!! It will be very interesting with the handshakes and the wink-winks and the nudge-nudges up to the expansion draft. I am SO curious about what is happening with the Nuge negotiation. I thought that one would be pretty straightforward, but it seems anything but that so far. If you are Nuge you want a long term deal,if your KH you want a short-term deal. KH offered markstrom a long term deal as we heard and that scares me that he is willing to do that still with players. I do not think as highly of Nuge compared to many here
|
|
|
Post by fogolin2 on Mar 25, 2021 10:31:55 GMT -7
It will depend on what either player wants (salary-wise) going forward. They're both UFA's, Nuge I think has more of a will/commitment to stay with the only team he's known, but Barrie probably couldn't dream of a better scenario than the one that's unfolded for him this season and maybe he will want to keep the good vibe going? Both may well be able to get more on the open market than here, so it will depend on who wants to be an oiler the most? I hope they both take team friendly contracts but wont blame them if they don't and we could end up with neither? If they both go, they will leave 2 huge holes to fill, the oilers long-term future is definitely in KH's hands this season and next. Yup. Could go either way with both players. One thing working in our favor is that not many good contending teams have as much cap room as we do next year. If these guys want fair deals, and be on a decent team, the Oilers are a good option. Obviously, that says nothing of the lifestyle choice they have to make so we'll see how that plays out.
|
|
|
Post by fogolin2 on Mar 25, 2021 10:33:41 GMT -7
Good point about the quarantine delay. Another consideration. Barrie did outscore Reilly, but he was about 20 points short of his previous years. And, in Leafland that gets you run out of town!! It will be very interesting with the handshakes and the wink-winks and the nudge-nudges up to the expansion draft. I am SO curious about what is happening with the Nuge negotiation. I thought that one would be pretty straightforward, but it seems anything but that so far. If you are Nuge you want a long term deal,if your KH you want a short-term deal. KH offered markstrom a long term deal as we heard and that scares me that he is willing to do that still with players. I do not think as highly of Nuge compared to many here I'm ok with term for Nuge, but he's been getting paid center-money while not being a center. If he wants a significant raise, then I think we can find an option that saves us enough that we can replace him with 2 players.
|
|
|
Post by windsoroiler on Mar 25, 2021 11:24:09 GMT -7
If you are Nuge you want a long term deal,if your KH you want a short-term deal. KH offered markstrom a long term deal as we heard and that scares me that he is willing to do that still with players. I do not think as highly of Nuge compared to many here I'm ok with term for Nuge, but he's been getting paid center-money while not being a center. If he wants a significant raise, then I think we can find an option that saves us enough that we can replace him with 2 players. Well let's debate with term for Nuge. We have a few players lighting it up in the AHL. Then there is that Hollaway guy... With signing Nuge to 6m or even 5 mil long term AAV if within two years someone passes him? There's a good chance...So while you want the club to be loyal, you need to have short term and long term plays. A Nuge contract over 3-4 years with everything going on is best for the club. He is asked to play a 2nd line center role with Mcd and Drai being the upmost focus for all teams right now. This gives Nuge a chance to light it up but he has only been ok. Without being on the top PP what would Nuge be worth just in terms of points? What would he do without McD and Drai. I see a Ryan Strome type of player as equal value to be honest. A good two way player at 4.5 mil.
|
|
|
Post by windsoroiler on Mar 25, 2021 11:39:23 GMT -7
Now that Turris has been activated he is my top 6 winger sleeper without any trades or acquisitions. While we all wished he would be an optimal 3C this has not been the case so you need to explore a players strengths vs weaknesses. He is not good enough on defense at C, he has skill, use him on the wing with less defensive responsibility to give him a chance to shine more. Just a gut feeling, from what players we have within.
|
|
|
Post by drtaf on Mar 25, 2021 12:28:26 GMT -7
I'm ok with term for Nuge, but he's been getting paid center-money while not being a center. If he wants a significant raise, then I think we can find an option that saves us enough that we can replace him with 2 players. Well let's debate with term for Nuge. We have a few players lighting it up in the AHL. Then there is that Hollaway guy... With signing Nuge to 6m or even 5 mil long term AAV if within two years someone passes him? There's a good chance...So while you want the club to be loyal, you need to have short term and long term plays. A Nuge contract over 3-4 years with everything going on is best for the club. He is asked to play a 2nd line center role with Mcd and Drai being the upmost focus for all teams right now. This gives Nuge a chance to light it up but he has only been ok. Without being on the top PP what would Nuge be worth just in terms of points? What would he do without McD and Drai. I see a Ryan Strome type of player as equal value to be honest. A good two way player at 4.5 mil. I thought we all agreed nuge is a 1st line winger not 2nd line center??LOL! Realistically, we can't move forward long-term with McD and Drai on same line. It's the perfect PP weapon or the nuclear option that we go to when we need to tilt the ice, but they need to run their own lines and need to have players that can keep up with them. Nuge compliments both really well and any long term deal for Nuge has to be with this caveat that he's a winger first and foremost who can be utilized in a pinch as a center. I think it's funny or ironic you say he's only worth $4.5M as I have said in the other thread that we can afford to and should buy out Neal if we can find someone for around $4M who can play in the top 6. Nuge can undoubtedly play in the top 6, but IMO he is going to want and get $6M or very close to it. now if KH can find a "nuge" for $4.5M, I say he should go out and buy 3 or 4 of them cos then we'd be stacked up front. I'm just hoping he can find 1 that is as close to nuge in skill and i'd be happy with that.
|
|
|
Post by windsoroiler on Mar 25, 2021 12:41:02 GMT -7
Well let's debate with term for Nuge. We have a few players lighting it up in the AHL. Then there is that Hollaway guy... With signing Nuge to 6m or even 5 mil long term AAV if within two years someone passes him? There's a good chance...So while you want the club to be loyal, you need to have short term and long term plays. A Nuge contract over 3-4 years with everything going on is best for the club. He is asked to play a 2nd line center role with Mcd and Drai being the upmost focus for all teams right now. This gives Nuge a chance to light it up but he has only been ok. Without being on the top PP what would Nuge be worth just in terms of points? What would he do without McD and Drai. I see a Ryan Strome type of player as equal value to be honest. A good two way player at 4.5 mil. I thought we all agreed nuge is a 1st line winger not 2nd line center??LOL! Realistically, we can't move forward long-term with McD and Drai on same line. It's the perfect PP weapon or the nuclear option that we go to when we need to tilt the ice, but they need to run their own lines and need to have players that can keep up with them. Nuge compliments both really well and any long term deal for Nuge has to be with this caveat that he's a winger first and foremost who can be utilized in a pinch as a center. I think it's funny or ironic you say he's only worth $4.5M as I have said in the other thread that we can afford to and should buy out Neal if we can find someone for around $4M who can play in the top 6. Nuge can undoubtedly play in the top 6, but IMO he is going to want and get $6M or very close to it. now if KH can find a "nuge" for $4.5M, I say he should go out and buy 3 or 4 of them cos then we'd be stacked up front. I'm just hoping he can find 1 that is as close to nuge in skill and i'd be happy with that. Normally yes, cap constrictions not only this year but moving forward. Just this year alone we expected an extra 4 mil cap space before the C word. Buying out Neal is not easy.
|
|
|
Post by fogolin2 on Mar 25, 2021 14:32:34 GMT -7
I'm ok with term for Nuge, but he's been getting paid center-money while not being a center. If he wants a significant raise, then I think we can find an option that saves us enough that we can replace him with 2 players. Well let's debate with term for Nuge. We have a few players lighting it up in the AHL. Then there is that Hollaway guy... With signing Nuge to 6m or even 5 mil long term AAV if within two years someone passes him? There's a good chance...So while you want the club to be loyal, you need to have short term and long term plays. A Nuge contract over 3-4 years with everything going on is best for the club. He is asked to play a 2nd line center role with Mcd and Drai being the upmost focus for all teams right now. This gives Nuge a chance to light it up but he has only been ok. Without being on the top PP what would Nuge be worth just in terms of points? What would he do without McD and Drai. I see a Ryan Strome type of player as equal value to be honest. A good two way player at 4.5 mil. I don't think it's reasonable to expect Nuge to take a pay cut, and I wouldn't expect to find a replacement at $6m. Your concerns about the depth coming up are valid, but I'm not counting those birds until they're in hand. Also, I'd love to be in a position where one of those guys is kicking the door in and we have to move a productive player to make room. I think Nuge will keep doing Nuge things, and would be very tradeable at $6m with contract control for several years. Disagree on the Strome comparison. I value how Nuge works with 29&97, and I prefer to bet on the knowns.
|
|
|
Post by igibb on Mar 25, 2021 15:04:15 GMT -7
The game requirements for the expansion draft have been pro-rated due to the two shortened seasons so the numbers Bronco posted are not correct. Here is the section (63) that explains it: media.nhl.com/site/asset/public/ext/2020-21/2020-21TransitionRulesCriticalDates.pdfThe new numbers are as follows: They have to be under contract in 2021-22 They played in 27 or more NHL games in 2020-21 OR They played in 54 or more NHL games in 2019-20- and 2020-21 combined That may change a few things with our plans. It definitely complicates things if we can't claim that Klef's injury is career threatening to get him exempt. We are also at a point cap wise where Holland said any salary coming in has to be going out. We have about $700,000 left on the LTIR now that pretty much everyone is back off it other than Klef and Koek which makes things extremely difficult unless we can unload an unwanted contract like Neal.
|
|
|
Post by fogolin2 on Mar 25, 2021 21:22:19 GMT -7
just saw this on the news
Darren Dreger @darrendreger NHL source confirms @davidwcochrane report the 14 day quarantine period in Canada has been reduced to 7 days with testing. This will help NHL clubs navigate trades with US based teams leading up to the April 12 trade deadline.
|
|
|
Post by windsoroiler on Mar 25, 2021 21:28:28 GMT -7
Well let's debate with term for Nuge. We have a few players lighting it up in the AHL. Then there is that Hollaway guy... With signing Nuge to 6m or even 5 mil long term AAV if within two years someone passes him? There's a good chance...So while you want the club to be loyal, you need to have short term and long term plays. A Nuge contract over 3-4 years with everything going on is best for the club. He is asked to play a 2nd line center role with Mcd and Drai being the upmost focus for all teams right now. This gives Nuge a chance to light it up but he has only been ok. Without being on the top PP what would Nuge be worth just in terms of points? What would he do without McD and Drai. I see a Ryan Strome type of player as equal value to be honest. A good two way player at 4.5 mil. I don't think it's reasonable to expect Nuge to take a pay cut, and I wouldn't expect to find a replacement at $6m. Your concerns about the depth coming up are valid, but I'm not counting those birds until they're in hand. Also, I'd love to be in a position where one of those guys is kicking the door in and we have to move a productive player to make room. I think Nuge will keep doing Nuge things, and would be very tradeable at $6m with contract control for several years. Disagree on the Strome comparison. I value how Nuge works with 29&97, and I prefer to bet on the knowns. Because if covid and the flat cap it is reasonable. If you don't think he's a Strome type player then at the very most he is a Guentzel type player. A high-end winger that is a complimentary player. He makes 6 million and Nuge would be him at best... If you want 6 million you need to shine on your own too which he has not.
|
|
|
Post by windsoroiler on Mar 26, 2021 10:42:56 GMT -7
Glad to see the time has been cut in half basically. If a guy sits for 2 weeks he needs some time to get up to speed so effectively 3 weeks. 7 day quarantine and the players is basically ready to play so 8-10 days total.
Klef had successful surgery but there's a decent chance he never plays again. It's not just the shoulder, it's the arthritis.
So KH has some tough decisions to make.
|
|
|
Post by Marshall Bruce Mathers III on Mar 26, 2021 11:42:00 GMT -7
The game requirements for the expansion draft have been pro-rated due to the two shortened seasons so the numbers Bronco posted are not correct. Here is the section (63) that explains it: media.nhl.com/site/asset/public/ext/2020-21/2020-21TransitionRulesCriticalDates.pdfThe new numbers are as follows: They have to be under contract in 2021-22 They played in 27 or more NHL games in 2020-21 OR They played in 54 or more NHL games in 2019-20- and 2020-21 combined That may change a few things with our plans. It definitely complicates things if we can't claim that Klef's injury is career threatening to get him exempt. We are also at a point cap wise where Holland said any salary coming in has to be going out. We have about $700,000 left on the LTIR now that pretty much everyone is back off it other than Klef and Koek which makes things extremely difficult unless we can unload an unwanted contract like Neal. 27 or more games in 2020-21? Could that be one of the reasons why Bouchard isn’t playing much? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
|
|