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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 3, 2024 8:19:31 GMT -7
It is, happy to have him for 8 years, not the $.
It appears over 50% of our cap will goto 4 players. Always going to be a fan but only one team in history has won with this model. IMO he went for the $.
You don't see Perry making his 8.5 mil anymore, lots of league minimum deals after 35 and 1 mil to play here. Is Drai worth 14 now and for half his contract, sure. Not team friendly at all. Is what it is. The > 50% model for the top guys is not the model for success. Our window is 2 years, once McD kicks in we will have no choice but to surround our team with fringe players as our top guys get older.
Anyways, happy to have him here. However our window to win has been shortened big time.
I say at least the window is still openš¤·āāļø If heād left or got traded my felling is the window closes immediately given that the oilers would have to have traded him before season starts realistically in the ātrade modelā. Is what it is, have optimism for 2 years, after that going down the shitter.
Now we are in cup or bust mode for sure. Just trying to be realistic if we have 4 guys taking over 1/2 the cap. Looking forward to hopefully see the very best of Leo for 4 years at least, after that can't expect everything.
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Post by toley on Sept 3, 2024 8:20:54 GMT -7
Just seen maybe it is confirmed now. It is, happy to have him for 8 years, not the $.
It appears over 50% of our cap will goto 4 players. Always going to be a fan but only one team in history has won with this model. IMO he went for the $.
You don't see Perry making his 8.5 mil anymore, lots of league minimum deals after 35 and 1 mil to play here. Is Drai worth 14 now and for half his contract, sure. Not team friendly at all. Is what it is. The > 50% model for the top guys is not the model for success. Our window is 2 years, once McD kicks in we will have no choice but to surround our team with fringe players as our top guys get older.
Anyways, happy to have him here. However our window to win has been shortened big time.
Did we not keep saying, it was going to be a high AAV? |
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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 3, 2024 8:36:19 GMT -7
It is, happy to have him for 8 years, not the $. It appears over 50% of our cap will goto 4 players. Always going to be a fan but only one team in history has won with this model. IMO he went for the $. You don't see Perry making his 8.5 mil anymore, lots of league minimum deals after 35 and 1 mil to play here. Is Drai worth 14 now and for half his contract, sure. Not team friendly at all. Is what it is. The > 50% model for the top guys is not the model for success. Our window is 2 years, once McD kicks in we will have no choice but to surround our team with fringe players as our top guys get older. Anyways, happy to have him here. However our window to win has been shortened big time.
Did we not keep saying, it was going to be a high AAV? Yep we all did but there was the hope that instead of 50%+ we would get the 4 guys at 46% or less of the cap. Since the cap era in 2005, that's how it works when it comes to winning cups. But hey there has been one team in history that has won with 4 guys making 50% of the cap, so it can happen lol. Just the messenger, those are the stats. I'm sure the Oilers have those stats too but no one cares. Drai took the max Matthews cap hit at 15.9% of the cap. Not even 15%, almost 16%. So now let's give McD 16 mil, Bouch 12. Once all that kicks in, 4 guys making 57% of the cap if the cap is 95-96 million. Crazy. Add the JC buyout of 2.2mil once Drai kicks in and 2.6 mil the year McD kicks in. That adds up to 60% of the cap to 4 players and JC's buyout (the year they sign their deals). 60% to 4 players + JC 40% to the 18 others. Lol. Not the recipe for winning. Sounds like SB in Chicago all over again. No being creative to try to defer money to lessen the blow either.
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Post by toley on Sept 3, 2024 8:43:37 GMT -7
Did we not keep saying, it was going to be a high AAV? Yep we all did but there was the hope that instead of 50%+ we would get the 4 guys at 46% or less of the cap. Since the cap era in 2005, that's how it works when it comes to winning cups. But hey there has been one team in history that has won with 4 guys making 50% of the cap, so it can happen lol. Just the messenger, those are the stats. I'm sure the Oilers have those stats too but no one cares. Drai took the max Matthews cap hit at 15.9% of the cap. Not even 15%, almost 16%. So now let's give McD 16 mil, Bouch 12. Once all that kicks in, 4 guys making 57% of the cap if the cap is 95-96 million. Crazy. Add the JC buyout of 2.2mil once Drai kicks in and 2.6 mil the year McD kicks in. That adds up to 60% of the cap to 4 players and JC's buyout (the year they sign their deals). 60% to 4 players + JC 40% to the 18 others. Lol. Not the recipe for winning. Sounds like SB in Chicago all over again. No being creative to try to defer money to lessen the blow either. You discount the cap will keep going up, its not going to be fixed at $88-$96 million. We also don't know how much it'll go up per year. So don't worry about it. Draisatl had all the cards, Bowman had to do this. |
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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 3, 2024 8:55:02 GMT -7
Yep we all did but there was the hope that instead of 50%+ we would get the 4 guys at 46% or less of the cap. Since the cap era in 2005, that's how it works when it comes to winning cups. But hey there has been one team in history that has won with 4 guys making 50% of the cap, so it can happen lol. Just the messenger, those are the stats. I'm sure the Oilers have those stats too but no one cares. Drai took the max Matthews cap hit at 15.9% of the cap. Not even 15%, almost 16%. So now let's give McD 16 mil, Bouch 12. Once all that kicks in, 4 guys making 57% of the cap if the cap is 95-96 million. Crazy. Add the JC buyout of 2.2mil once Drai kicks in and 2.6 mil the year McD kicks in. That adds up to 60% of the cap to 4 players and JC's buyout (the year they sign their deals). 60% to 4 players + JC 40% to the 18 others. Lol. Not the recipe for winning. Sounds like SB in Chicago all over again. No being creative to try to defer money to lessen the blow either. You discount the cap will keep going up, its not going to be fixed at $88-$96 million. We also don't know how much it'll go up per year. So don't worry about it. Draisatl had all the cards, Bowman had to do this. Reinhart had all the cards too, will leave it at that. It's not that hard to project forward. To add to the math above even if cap is 100 mil, Hyms and Nuge take up over 10% of the cap, Skinner if he improves can be an 8-10 mil goalie. Even though JC buyout will drop by a million, we have 20-25% of the cap left for 14-15 players. That's ok, the Savoie's, Lavoie's will come in to save us, and if they do another team will come in and scoop them up due to our cap situation. Oilers are putting themselves in a bind, even before they get into a bind. Let's enjoy the next year and hopefully two. You're right no use worrying, we can contend now and that's what all of us want.
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Post by toley on Sept 3, 2024 9:12:40 GMT -7
You discount the cap will keep going up, its not going to be fixed at $88-$96 million. We also don't know how much it'll go up per year. So don't worry about it. Draisatl had all the cards, Bowman had to do this. Reinhart had all the cards too, will leave it at that. It's not that hard to project forward. To add to the math above even if cap is 100 mil, Hyms and Nuge take up over 10% of the cap, Skinner if he improves can be an 8-10 mil goalie. Even though JC buyout will drop by a million, we have 20-25% of the cap left for 14-15 players. That's ok, the Savoie's, Lavoie's will come in to save us, and if they do another team will come in and scoop them up due to our cap situation. Oilers are putting themselves in a bind, even before they get into a bind. Let's enjoy the next year and hopefully two. You're right no use worrying, we can contend now and that's what all of us want. Reinhart isn't Draisatl, he doesn't have multiple 100 point, 50 goal seasons. And doesn't have a Hart, and Lindsay to negotiate with. Didn't Crosby take up 17% of a much lower cap and won 2 cups after? I might be mistaken about timing. |
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Post by yuke on Sept 3, 2024 9:15:33 GMT -7
You discount the cap will keep going up, its not going to be fixed at $88-$96 million. We also don't know how much it'll go up per year. So don't worry about it. Draisatl had all the cards, Bowman had to do this. Reinhart had all the cards too, will leave it at that. It's not that hard to project forward. To add to the math above even if cap is 100 mil, Hyms and Nuge take up over 10% of the cap, Skinner if he improves can be an 8-10 mil goalie. Even though JC buyout will drop by a million, we have 20-25% of the cap left for 14-15 players. That's ok, the Savoie's, Lavoie's will come in to save us, and if they do another team will come in and scoop them up due to our cap situation. Oilers are putting themselves in a bind, even before they get into a bind. Let's enjoy the next year and hopefully two. You're right no use worrying, we can contend now and that's what all of us want. Your comparables are not valid. Rienhart had 1 year that matches Leon. Using Perry and Stamkos are laughable. Perry is not a player close to Leon and Stamkos contract starts at 34 not 30. You are not comparing apple to apples. And yes, 14 million is not team friendly unless somehow there us deferred money |
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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 3, 2024 9:38:34 GMT -7
Reinhart had all the cards too, will leave it at that. It's not that hard to project forward. To add to the math above even if cap is 100 mil, Hyms and Nuge take up over 10% of the cap, Skinner if he improves can be an 8-10 mil goalie. Even though JC buyout will drop by a million, we have 20-25% of the cap left for 14-15 players. That's ok, the Savoie's, Lavoie's will come in to save us, and if they do another team will come in and scoop them up due to our cap situation. Oilers are putting themselves in a bind, even before they get into a bind. Let's enjoy the next year and hopefully two. You're right no use worrying, we can contend now and that's what all of us want. Reinhart isn't Draisatl, he doesn't have multiple 100 point, 50 goal seasons. And doesn't have a Hart, and Lindsay to negotiate with. Didn't Crosby take up 17% of a much lower cap and won 2 cups after? I might be mistaken about timing. That's fine.
Crosby did 13.5% of the cap and Malkin 13.7% of the cap which was the talking point all summer and they won 2 cups. Which was the hopeful Drai 11.5-12 mil not 14... Did the max vote in the Drai contract thread because it's more realistic to be at 13-15, not 11-12. We can disagree on the players and who's better or not, who's worth more or not but the stats above do not lie.
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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 3, 2024 9:48:05 GMT -7
Reinhart had all the cards too, will leave it at that. It's not that hard to project forward. To add to the math above even if cap is 100 mil, Hyms and Nuge take up over 10% of the cap, Skinner if he improves can be an 8-10 mil goalie. Even though JC buyout will drop by a million, we have 20-25% of the cap left for 14-15 players. That's ok, the Savoie's, Lavoie's will come in to save us, and if they do another team will come in and scoop them up due to our cap situation. Oilers are putting themselves in a bind, even before they get into a bind. Let's enjoy the next year and hopefully two. You're right no use worrying, we can contend now and that's what all of us want. Your comparables are not valid. Rienhart had 1 year that matches Leon. Using Perry and Stamkos are laughable. Perry is not a player close to Leon and Stamkos contract starts at 34 not 30. You are not comparing apple to apples. And yes, 14 million is not team friendly unless somehow there us deferred money Perry not comparable to Drai? He has done everything and more, won everything. Mr Clutch, so good that all of us dreaded him. After 34-35 there has been a decline, hence he does not make 8+ mil anymore he's making 1 million. Why is that? Ryan is declining, why is that? Keith was declining and he retired, why is that? Henrique and Eks, it's a safe bet that they will start to slow down too, if not already. Lucic and Kane, their declines started earlier. Nuge and Hyms, hopefully another year or two before they start their declines. Nurse isn't even 30 yet and he's started to decline. Doubt it's age in this case, signing a big deal and not living up to it more likely. See Peterson in Vancouver. Huge deal then falloff, it happens. Fine with Drai's contract for the 1st half of it, no matter how much the cap goes up it will be a huge overpay for the 2nd half of his deal.
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Post by happyhappy on Sept 3, 2024 10:30:58 GMT -7
Reinhart had all the cards too, will leave it at that. It's not that hard to project forward. To add to the math above even if cap is 100 mil, Hyms and Nuge take up over 10% of the cap, Skinner if he improves can be an 8-10 mil goalie. Even though JC buyout will drop by a million, we have 20-25% of the cap left for 14-15 players. That's ok, the Savoie's, Lavoie's will come in to save us, and if they do another team will come in and scoop them up due to our cap situation. Oilers are putting themselves in a bind, even before they get into a bind. Let's enjoy the next year and hopefully two. You're right no use worrying, we can contend now and that's what all of us want. Your comparables are not valid. Rienhart had 1 year that matches Leon. Using Perry and Stamkos are laughable. Perry is not a player close to Leon and Stamkos contract starts at 34 not 30. You are not comparing apple to apples. And yes, 14 million is not team friendly unless somehow there us deferred money I heard McDd is willing to sign a deferred contract and we'll only have to pay him 1.5 mil x8 and after that we pay him 100 mil over the next 20 years when he retires and that money won't be on the cap, so we're golden!  Seriously though. Leon got what he deserved and he could have got more on the open market guaranteed. No, not a discount but we've had him on a massive discount for the past 8 years. Projections I've read on an 8 yr term for Drais were 13.1 (Athletic) and 13.5 (Evolving Hockey) so he came in just over that but still less then a mil, only half in one case. That little of money is not going to make or break us though every dollar helps, I have absolutely zero problem with this contract. There are lots of star players that remain elite in their later yrs also, the Kopitars and such of the league and I'm not worried about any big drop-off in Leon's play down the road. Time will tell. Very happy for LD and all us Oiler fans who get to keep enjoying his stellar work on the ice for many years to come!
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Post by easternoilslick on Sept 3, 2024 10:51:21 GMT -7
I'm happy with thus signing. It all but guarantees McD signing long term with us when it's his turn. Managing the other contracts of course is going to be challenging but we have already seen signings taking lower to play with these guys. What other team can boast that? Having the two best players in the world is going to cost us.
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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 3, 2024 11:11:20 GMT -7
Does anyone have the link to the presser, missed it on TSN?
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Post by yuke on Sept 3, 2024 11:36:03 GMT -7
Your comparables are not valid. Rienhart had 1 year that matches Leon. Using Perry and Stamkos are laughable. Perry is not a player close to Leon and Stamkos contract starts at 34 not 30. You are not comparing apple to apples. And yes, 14 million is not team friendly unless somehow there us deferred money Perry not comparable to Drai? He has done everything and more, won everything. Mr Clutch, so good that all of us dreaded him. After 34-35 there has been a decline, hence he does not make 8+ mil anymore he's making 1 million. Why is that? Ryan is declining, why is that? Keith was declining and he retired, why is that? Henrique and Eks, it's a safe bet that they will start to slow down too, if not already. Lucic and Kane, their declines started earlier. Nuge and Hyms, hopefully another year or two before they start their declines. Nurse isn't even 30 yet and he's started to decline. Doubt it's age in this case, signing a big deal and not living up to it more likely. See Peterson in Vancouver. Huge deal then falloff, it happens. Fine with Drai's contract for the 1st half of it, no matter how much the cap goes up it will be a huge overpay for the 2nd half of his deal. Unfortunately the NHL doesn't allow a 2 tier contract. $$$$ for 4 years and $$ for the last 4. Cory Perry was a good winger in his day, Leon is in a category higher at any point in Cory's career. |
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Post by sharptooth on Sept 3, 2024 11:42:56 GMT -7
Pleased he is signed. Worry about cap when it becomes an issue or if it does at all. Gotta pay to keep players of this caliber
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Post by happyhappy on Sept 3, 2024 12:07:21 GMT -7
Reinhart isn't Draisatl, he doesn't have multiple 100 point, 50 goal seasons. And doesn't have a Hart, and Lindsay to negotiate with. Didn't Crosby take up 17% of a much lower cap and won 2 cups after? I might be mistaken about timing. That's fine.
Crosby did 13.5% of the cap and Malkin 13.7% of the cap which was the talking point all summer and they won 2 cups. Which was the hopeful Drai 11.5-12 mil not 14... Did the max vote in the Drai contract thread because it's more realistic to be at 13-15, not 11-12. We can disagree on the players and who's better or not, who's worth more or not but the stats above do not lie.
Hmmm, I read, Leon at 14 aav under a 92mil cap in 25/26 = 15.27% Sid at 8.7 under a 56.7mil cap in 08/09 = 15.34% Not to stir the pot, just what I read. It's all t1t for tat now.
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Post by happyhappy on Sept 3, 2024 12:07:41 GMT -7
Does anyone have the link to the presser, missed it on TSN?
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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 3, 2024 12:48:28 GMT -7
Looks like a dumb Fogolin2, just give them what they want no questions asked. Hawks are my 2nd fav team and have a decent idea how this goes. Over many years. SB repeat...
Am entitled to my opinion. Bring in a guy who has won cups and had success but no negotiation tactics or understanding in terms of the now or future success, lets just be oblivious and focus on the now 110%.
I dub SB as the drunken sailor. Oilers make too many mistakes and the trend continues.
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Post by fogolin2 on Sept 3, 2024 22:29:15 GMT -7
Looks like a dumb Fogolin2, just give them what they want no questions asked. Hawks are my 2nd fav team and have a decent idea how this goes. Over many years. SB repeat... Am entitled to my opinion. Bring in a guy who has won cups and had success but no negotiation tactics or understanding in terms of the now or future success, lets just be oblivious and focus on the now 110%. I dub SB as the drunken sailor. Oilers make too many mistakes and the trend continues. Windsor top vacuum GM in the league. Kucherov discounts for life. |
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Post by SuperDave17 on Sept 4, 2024 0:37:21 GMT -7
From Drai to the fans ...
Du hast mich acht Jahre lang!!!
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Post by windsoroiler on Sept 4, 2024 6:46:03 GMT -7
Looks like a dumb Fogolin2, just give them what they want no questions asked. Hawks are my 2nd fav team and have a decent idea how this goes. Over many years. SB repeat... Am entitled to my opinion. Bring in a guy who has won cups and had success but no negotiation tactics or understanding in terms of the now or future success, lets just be oblivious and focus on the now 110%. I dub SB as the drunken sailor. Oilers make too many mistakes and the trend continues. Windsor top vacuum GM in the league. Kucherov discounts for life. Care to win for as long as possible. With this contract and McD's, there a chance we have to say bye bye to Bouch to make it all work. We'll see. OIler fans are thrilled as we rarely get a star player to sign for life here, no matter the cost. I get it. Drai said himself there was not much negotiation. Biggest contract in the league and SB does a zoom call. Drai is in Edmonton, not sure why SB can't be there, instead he stays in Chicago. Can't even have a proper press conference when a star player signs a huge deal.
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